Uh-Oh
jimcroce
December 29, 2009 (8:29 AM)
View Link |
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Herb
December 29, 2009 (8:52 AM)
Hey Croce, why aren't you posting under your real name?
WTF?
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thor
December 29, 2009 (11:39 AM)
Might as well get Zirbel's side of the story...that means a
lot to me
In an e-mail from Zirbel on December 28th:
Hello family & friends,
First off, Happy Holidays! Secondly, sorry for the timing
of this bad news but the story is going to break tomorrow
and I would like you to hear it from me first.
As some of you know but many of you do not, I have been in
the middle of a nightmare for the past 7 weeks or so. My
'A' sample tested positive for a steroid known as DHEA from
a urine analysis taken on Aug. 29 after the US Pro TT. If
my 'B' sample goes positive as well I will get a suspension
from cycling (1-2 years). I was notified about the 'A'
sample in mid November and wasn't going to say anything
until I got the 'B' back but people love gossip and the
press got wind of it. I am hoping that if you made this
email list, you know me well enough to know that I would
never dope for cycling. At this point, I'm not sure how the
DHEA got into my system but I understand that it is a common
contaminant in supplements. I can only assume that
something that I took the week leading up to the test was
contaminated somehow. I had a test 8 days before the
positive and 3 days after that were both clean. I have a
few really good doctors and scientists looking at my case
and doing some tests to help me find out how this happened.
The way I understand the system, if I can prove that the
DHEA came from a contaminated source without my knowing, I
will get a reduced suspension (1 year) and my name cleared.
Not a very good consolation prize but the best we can do at
this point. If it does turn out to be a 1 year suspension,
I will weather the storm, find part time work, continue to
train and try to get a job racing for 2011. But if it's 2
or more years, I may just say 'f*ck it' and move on to the
next chapter of my life. I'm quite bitter about this whole
experience and I know there are plenty of other things in
this world that I could be happy doing. I've been trying to
brush aside the 'woe is me' thoughts and focus on the
positives: I have my health and I have wonderful,
supportive friends and family to name a few. I don't know
what else to say. I'll keep you updated as best I can, but
it may be some time before we find out anything definitive.
If you have questions, concerns, and/or comments please
contact our PR department (this email address) and we will
try to get back to you as soon as energy or mood allows.
Tom
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pocohontas
December 29, 2009 (12:03 PM)
I hate it that ZIrbel is going through this. Of course,
anyone who knows Zirbel knows that he would NEVER do
something like that. What a disaster. It couldn't have
happened to a more honest, stand up guy.
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admin
December 29, 2009 (2:57 PM)
Yeah, this makes me sick to my stomach just reading the
comments on the blogs and such. For those that know him,
there is no question that he wouldn't knowingly take a
banned substance. For those that don't, I would just hope
they can look at the facts and motives - the benefits of
DHEA (probably none), the probability of supplement
contamination (high) and the chance of getting caught
(almost assuredly). But most of all, just watch how Zirbel
handles himself throughout this situation before jumping to
conclusions. ( Example: View
Link ) This is no different than how we've seen him
handle everything throughout his life; with honesty and
class.
The "B" sample will come out soon. Obviously, I
hope it comes up negative for his cycling career and public
perception. Two things will not change regardless of the
result; 1) Unfortunately, damage has been and will continue
to be incurred for Tom. 2) Our perception, trust and
support of Tom.
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lehmanhatesbaldorf
December 29, 2009 (3:36 PM)
This is just mind blowing for Tommy and for the rest of us.
I don't know what Tom does 24 hours a day but I know what
Tom stands for and that is honesty and integrity. I find it
incredibly unfair that baseball players "caught"
using banned substances don't hardly get punished anymore
but a mistake showing traces of a banned substance that has
zero benefits gets a one year suspension and cleared record.
Big f*cking deal! When you're 30 you don't have much time
left and a one year suspension is damn near an eternity.
That's a harsh sentence--good luck, Tommy, we're here for
you. Trials of miles, brother.
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lehmanhatesbaldorf
December 29, 2009 (3:42 PM)
And who is "Jim Croce?" Are you a legit poster or
just someone trying to smear our friend? I guess nothing
sums up Zirbel better than this statement: "'The US Pro
TT was a major objective of mine this season, but I would
never compromise my integrity for any bike race,' Zirbel
said."
If you're one of us, post under your own name. If you're
just some troll then get a life and quit delighting in
someone's personal nightmare.
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pocohontas
December 29, 2009 (4:39 PM)
I am getting VERY upset with the blogs and posts about our
friend. It shows how jaded the sports world is now because
of steroids and banned substances that they automatically
conclude that someone claiming innocence is lying. One of
the articles claiming that because he has been a chemistry
major it is an easy connection that he knowingly took the
substances and they don't appreciate his "aw
shucks" attitude. That especially ticks me off. Of
course I care about Zirbs cycling career but it is his good
name that I'm upset is getting smeared. I look up to Zirbel
in so many ways in how he carries himself and how committed
and hardworking he has always been and that will be the real
shame that he won't be seen in that light.
I have alerted Zirbel that I believe Marcus Murphy is
somehow behind this,and he feels this is a likely cause.
I think other usual suspects could include but are not
limited to Oscar Kardinas-Mitchell's arch-nemesis, the other
schools in the Iowa Conference, and of course, The Man.
Man, this is just pissing me off the more I think about it.
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mulp
December 29, 2009 (5:35 PM)
Croce is a real person, fyi. And I have a suspicion that it
was not meant as a troll attempt.
If any of you have ever heard of someone being busted,
whether it be in track or cycling, how did you react? People
that don't know Zirbel are going to assume he is guilty the
same way any of us assumed someone else was that we didn't
know when they had a positive test. People are
understandably jaded, with the plethora of big names that
have lie about using PEDs.
That's not saying I think Zirbel is guilty. I do not, and
this is a terrible thing for him to have to go through. From
the hand full of times I've encountered him, he has seemed
about as upstanding as they come.
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thor
December 29, 2009 (5:42 PM)
A little more information on this Jim Croce guy if you
please, Cody...
The only info. that I have is that Jim Croce was a legendary
musician in the 70's who died in a plane crash.
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mulp
December 29, 2009 (5:47 PM)
I was just saying that it wasn't meant as a smear attempt,
more of an alert to everyone on here that didn't
know--before they read it somewhere else I guess. I'll let
Croce state his or her name. But, I figured I could maybe
calm people down if they thought it was meant to piss people
off here.
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Herb
December 29, 2009 (6:11 PM)
It was a bullsh*t way to post it. Croce knows it. Why else
would he or she post under a fake name? It's also an odd
choice of words for the thread - uh-oh. Croce is being a
p*ssy. Croce knows it. Cody, you know it, don't try to
spin it.
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admin
December 29, 2009 (6:20 PM)
Well this is pretty much ground zero of Zirbel's best
friends and it hit a major nerve. This was his first post
ever, he used a fake name, there was no other text, the
title was annoying and the article was not particularly
supportive of Zirbel. In retrospect, I'm guessing he can
see how it would be less than well-received. That being
said, if it wasn't meant as a smear attempt then no hard
feelings. For future reference, just always post with your
real name as it is easy find that out via social networking
and the like anyway.
Best Regards,
Admin
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mulp
December 29, 2009 (6:20 PM)
Just trying to keep the peace Mitchell. I'll agree it could
have been posted in a better way, without a doubt, but I
don't think it was meant the way it comes off. And if it
was, then I agree with you.
And I didn't realize it was the first post on here under
that name.
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admin
December 29, 2009 (7:02 PM)
Yeah, I'm going to take a wild, flying leap guess and say
Brian Chenowith. Sorry, if I'm wrong, but I doubt it. If
so, I'm sure you meant no harm, but can probably see how it
could be so poorly received. If it is, please step forward,
take your verbal lashing from Mitchell and be done with it.
No hard feelings.
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thedrys
December 29, 2009 (10:38 PM)
My heart goes out to Tom. I haven't had the pleasure of
hanging out with him much but everything about him is down
to earth and forthright. I can't think of worse timing for
something like this to happen, especially on he verge of
working with Garmin. As a team Garmin is very anti-doping
and it just doesn't make any logical sense for an individual
who dopes to sign with a team who strives to be as
transparent as Garmin.
I know I've heard of this happening before, but is it
possible that a supplement that was free of 'agents' was
processed in a machine that previously manufactured
supplements that contained banned substances? That could
leave trace elements in the next batch.
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pocohontas
December 30, 2009 (4:16 AM)
Basically what we're trying to say is don't f^% with Zirbel.
I don't care if you know him or not, if you are on this
site, you know of him and he is someone to be respected and
admired. Anyone who knows him can atest to this. This does
show what TEAM is and those of us who were teammates with
Zirbel, will stand behind him and know that he didn't
knowingly ingest anything that would compromise his
integrity. Don't F$#@ with the family:)
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pocohontas
December 30, 2009 (4:17 AM)
PS-Jim Croce also wrote some songs in the seventies and they
blew in comparison to the other music of the day. Am I right
Mitchell or am I right?
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Nauman
December 30, 2009 (8:58 AM)
Say positive Zirbelt! Your Wartburg family is behind you.
And I agree with Abby, I think it is the man.
Damn the Man, Damn the Man!
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Herb
December 30, 2009 (9:05 AM)
I like Jim Croce's music.
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jimcroce
December 30, 2009 (11:23 AM)
Sorry for pissing you guys off. ive had the name for a
couple years now, didnt realize i had never posted with it.
I didnt post it as an attack on tom, just found out, wanted
to see what others who knew more than me had to say about
it. definitely hope it isnt true, and hope it gets cleared
up. sucks that if 2nd test comes back clean no one will
believe it anyway.
chenoweth
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Herb
December 30, 2009 (12:21 PM)
I am glad you are no longer anonymous.
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Mickey
December 30, 2009 (7:30 PM)
I just want Zirbel to know that we love, support and believe
him. I can't imagine what he's going through right now but I
have been so upset by this and my heart breaks for him.
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admin
December 30, 2009 (9:36 PM)
Well said comment on Zirbel by Olympic medalist Canadian
triathlete Simon Whitfield in this article ( View Link
)
"It's a bit of a strange system. You have a guy in
cycling right now who is going to serve a two-year ban for
inadvertently taking something in a supplement. He's serving
more time than a guy who blatantly cheated with the latest
and greatest doping products."
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thor
December 30, 2009 (11:58 PM)
It really makes you wish you could do something...how is it
that a man of Zirbel's character can't get a fair trial?
Look at all of the other tests that were taken during that
same period. All negative. With debacles like this it is
no surprise why cycling is failing to reach its maximum
potential in popularity.
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mulp
December 31, 2009 (7:20 AM)
That, and the rampant drug usage in the sport, that makes
people skeptical of anyone that has a positive test.
Regardless of intentions or innocence. It's going to be hard
for anyone that doesn't personally know someone (in this
case Zirbel) to believe them when they have a positive test.
It is sad that cycling (and T&F) have come to this, but
that's unfortunately the reality of these sports now. And
unlike a sport such as baseball, it's not so easily
forgiven--again, regardless of circumstances.
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admin
January 3, 2010 (4:47 PM)
So I'm wondering if it might not actually be contaminated
supplements that would have triggered a positive test. In
Zirbel's interview he mentions that the only thing different
on the day of the failed test was that he was extremely
dehydrated ( View
Link ). He doesn't speculate on that, but I will.
Unless I'm misunderstanding, DHEA is naturally occurring in
the body and a failed test is due to abnormally high levels
within the body. Thus, perhaps one cause could be that DHEA
appeared in a higher concentration due to dehydration.
Maybe that's just one potential cause they are exploring.
But out of anyone, it would probably surprise me least if
there was something weird NATURALLY going on with Zirbel's
levels. For God's sake the guy is 6'5", 200 pounds, an
endurance freak of nature, has a protrusion from his chest
and can express milk from his nipples. Plus he used to get
so dehydrated in XC that his salt production/loss could have
competed with the salt production of some small third-world
countries. Just a thought.
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thedrys
January 13, 2010 (6:19 PM)
I know these things can take forever, but is there any new
information or updates?
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flyingsquirrel
January 14, 2010 (8:29 AM)
Good luck Tom. I'm with the others right behind you.
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admin
January 14, 2010 (11:18 PM)
Click here to see the message that this refers to.
Nothing yet, but this interview serves as a good update...
View Link
Also, check out the two most recent posts to Zirb's blog (
View
Link/ ).
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pocohontas
January 16, 2010 (8:26 PM)
I love Zirbel and I appreciate that big weirdo's sense of
humor with his t-shirt and all. Its funny if Kristen
laughs...
Just some other laughs to remember, Lifehouse was on Conan
O'Brian last week and I was reminded of Kenny singing a
Lifehouse song to his bride at their wedding reception and
then I remembered Baldwin and my attempt at humor and the
only person I could hear laughing was Zirbel and then Baker
giving the worst speech of all time. Oh the memories!!!
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lehmanhatesbaldorf
January 16, 2010 (10:08 PM)
Abby, those are memories Sara is definately trying to
repress...
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Mickey
January 17, 2010 (8:58 AM)
Speaking of memories...
View Link
seaweed eaters in 50º water.
buncha awesome weirdos, the lot of ya.
(i'm starting to scan in a bunch of old photos that i plan
on sharing here, stay tuned!)
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lehmanhatesbaldorf
January 17, 2010 (5:51 PM)
Awesome...
Baldwin had such chicken legs.
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thor
January 17, 2010 (9:22 PM)
Keep 'em coming! I always did love Baldwin's chicken legs!
Mmm, Mmm, Good!!
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admin
January 17, 2010 (9:27 PM)
That is a classic picture. Brock, I thought I remembered
you being older than the age of 9 at that camp. Where's the
fat Tyson picture?
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thor
January 18, 2010 (9:34 AM)
Not only is Brock 9, but he is also emerging from Zirbel's
body...I don't remember when Tommy ate Brock...
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lehmanhatesbaldorf
January 18, 2010 (12:11 PM)
Ha, ha, ha--Fat Tyson! If that doesn't appear in the
"memories" section it should probably be added.
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thor
January 18, 2010 (12:27 PM)
What has happened to Sir Tyson anyway? Is he fat again?
Somebody needs to snap a photo of the little guy when he is
at the 'W' in his two piece swim suit please!
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lehmanhatesbaldorf
January 18, 2010 (3:45 PM)
It's hard to say for the Little Feller--the bastard doesn't
return his phone calls. I hate his caller ID...
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mulp
January 18, 2010 (5:18 PM)
I called him on friday and he called me back and left a
message Brock. So suck on that!
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Mickey
January 18, 2010 (5:49 PM)
OK you asked for it, here is another classic:
View Link
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pocohontas
January 18, 2010 (8:47 PM)
I own the original of Fat Tyson, I bring it with me to the
weight room to keep me motivated to no turn into that...
Next snow day I'm gonna start scanning some pics, in some of
them Baldwin still has hair!! Kenny still has a bald spot
though.
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thedrys
January 18, 2010 (9:14 PM)
That last photo was...disturbing to say the least.
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admin
January 18, 2010 (9:42 PM)
What is Brenda Warner doing standing between Herb and Zirbs
in that last pic? ( View Link )
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thor
January 18, 2010 (11:32 PM)
Don't you remember Baldwin?...We had invited Kurt over for
the annual XC football game and Brenda tagged along. At
this point in the day, Kurt was passed out on the Alamo
couch after enjoying too much jungle juice.
Regardless, Zirbel is still cuter than Brenda in this pic.
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lehmanhatesbaldorf
January 19, 2010 (9:37 AM)
Personally I would think the picture of "Fat
Tyson" should remain in the kitchen, perhaps on the
fridge door near the beverages, so you are reminded what not
to consume while not working out...
I really think Mitchell got a lot of mileage out of that
camo dress. With all his hair, especially on his face and
chest, he looks like an Italian chick.
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lehmanhatesbaldorf
January 19, 2010 (10:29 AM)
To answer your question, Peepers, I doubt there are a lot of
Year-End XC parties Baldwin can really remember in detail.
Or Halloween Parties. Or Wine and Cheese Parties. Or most
Wednesday/Friday/Saturday nights...
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Mickey
January 19, 2010 (10:35 AM)
we put the junior in JV:
View Link
i have only quickly gone through one album thus far, i was
going to do another tonight after work.
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admin
January 19, 2010 (11:29 AM)
Click here to see the message that this refers to.
Say what you will Brock, but from what I've heard, my
college years were a blast.
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rooster
January 19, 2010 (12:37 PM)
It is wierd, Dion has slept with all of those people, but
one...can any one guess who the one was... (this ought to
be fun...)
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Nauman
January 19, 2010 (12:46 PM)
I thought everyone has slept with Dion... He was the team
bicycle
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admin
January 21, 2010 (9:22 PM)
I don't know how this movie was able to predict this
injustice all the way back in 1986, but it sure is fitting
now...
Login or regi
ster to view images within posts instead of links to
images. View Link
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lehmanhatesbaldorf
January 22, 2010 (10:04 PM)
Where in the heck did you find something like that? You are
a crazy guy, Billy, a crazy guy...
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Nauman
January 23, 2010 (11:22 AM)
Bueller?... Bueller?... Bueller?
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General
January 31, 2010 (11:24 PM)
It's late and I'm bored so I typed up some stuff about
DHEA.
Hmmmm... I wonder if I can post a comment this long...
I found a nasty comment on Zirbel's blog that was from
BikePure.org and then I found an article on DHEA and I was
quite disappointed in the quality of the claims it made and
I commented as such. Somewhat surprisingly I received a
reply from the author and encouragement to provide some
better science on the subject.
I'm happy to try to do so. While I share the feelings that
the sport needs to be cleaned up, I also feel that we need
to do it without resorting to a witch hunt and without
resorting to ruining the careers and possibly lives of
athletes. In order to do this we need to make sure that the
science behind any conviction is rigorous and we also need
to make sure that the punishments for violations fit the
crimes. A two-year suspension for first time use of
EPO-Cera may be quite reasonable, while the same suspension
for a chemical that shows no benefit to performance and that
is a common unlabeled contaminant in food supplements sold
at your local discount store is clearly an excessive
punishment.
To begin, try doing a Google search for P.J. Skerret who is
cited in the BikePure article. The top hit will be
Quackwatch.com with an article from a newsletter produced by
The New England Journal of Medicine explaining how
"…there's no convincing evidence for any benefit of
DHEA…" The P.J. Skerret claims of benefits of DHEA are
merely marketing claims of a quack that are frequently
reproduced to drum up sales.
Furthermore, the study from the New York Academy of Sciences
sounds like an excellent peer-reviewed source. And it
surely is, but it is not on the subject we are discussing.
The study was about DHEA use as an anti-aging supplement
rather than an ergogenic aid. The study commonly gets
misused by retailers trying to increase sales of DHEA as it
is possibly the only one that implies you will get a benefit
from using DHEA.
The rest of the scientific literature is much more likely to
point out that using DHEA will actually harm your athletic
performance. The most cited study on DHEA as a sports
supplement is by Mark Juhn in Sports Medicine. He says
"The androgenic precursors androstenedione and
dehydroepiandrosterone [DHEA] have not been shown to
increase any parameters of strength and have potentially
significant adverse effects."
In the November 1, 2008 edition of The American Family
Physician: A peer reviewed journal of the American Academy
of Family Physicians it says, "[A]ndrostenedione and
DHEA are marketed as being able to build muscle and increase
strength by increasing serum testosterone. However,
supplementation has not been shown to increase testosterone
levels, strength, or performance in clinical studies.
Androstenedione supplementation was not able to increase
strength as measured by a one-repetition maximal bench press
or by total weight lifted per workout. DHEA did not
increase mean strength over weeks of supplementation.
Adverse effects of androstenedione and DHEA include a
sustained increase in serum estrogen…"
Michael S. Bahrke and Charles Yesalis site multiple studies
dealing with DHEA in their book Performance-enhancing
Substances in Sport and Excercise. The studies showed that
DHEA didn't enhance skeletal muscle, DHEA didn't effect
energy expenditure or protein metabolism, and DHEA doesn't
play an important role in energy metabolism.
In a 2006 article on ergogenic aids in young athletes from
Pediatrics: Official Journal of the American Academy of
Pediatrics they say, "those who received the drug
showed no change in any athletic measure…In the literature
to date, there is no convincing evidence that these
prohormones have any true benefit for the athletes…"
As to the claims that any serious athlete would know if he
or she ingested DHEA, the British Journal of Sports Medicine
addressed the issue in its November 2007 issue in the
article "The continuing story of nutritional
supplements and doping infractions". The article
begins by saying, "Nutritional supplements can be a
source of positive doping cases as some supplements contain
prohibited substances without showing this on their label.
This problem has existed for some time and has been
extensively studied in the past 8 years."
They go on to say, "…that paper-based quality systems
are still prone to possible contaminations, which leads to
the conclusion that the best possible solution for athletes
who wish to use nutritional supplements must include
laboratory-based analysis for doping substances, preferably
repeated for every new batch." So, if an athlete wants
to know what he or she is taking, he or she needs to pay to
have each and every bottle tested by a laboratory.
WADA knows that supplement contamination is a huge problem
but choses to ignore it. As the BJSM reports from WADA's
own study, "This study showed that 14.8% of 634 freely
available substances contained anabolic agents that were not
declared on the label." Yes, that is right, you have
almost a 1 in 6 chance of getting a supplement contaminated
with something on WADA's banned list that is not on the
supplement label. If you take any pills, powders, gels,
energy bars, etc. you should be worried.
And these contaminants didn't just show up in supplements
marketed to boost performance such as muscle-building
protein powders and recovery drinks, they showed up even in
simple vitamin pills due to cross-contamination from the
manufacturer.
I think once you actually look at the scientific evidence on
DHEA in sport and supplement contamination you really have
to wonder about whether Tom deserves any punishment in this
case beyond what he has already suffered. At the least, you
have to doubt whether the same punishment can be appropriate
for this case and an EPO-Cera case. So, let's stop this
crucifixion of Tom and put our energies toward cleaning up
our sport without ruining lives without scientific basis.
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lehmanhatesbaldorf
February 1, 2010 (8:24 AM)
Would this poster be Lee? If it is I would've expected such
a great response. Well written and researched. My
question, then, is with this knowledge, does Tom stand a
fighting chance or will the governing body continue to treat
all banned substances, from EPO-Cera to DHEA, as a
one-size-fits-all, regardless of undocumented/unintended
additive?
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admin
February 1, 2010 (9:12 AM)
Thanks for the great info Lee. Now that the fight really
begins I'm wondering if and how we can help Tom. I have
purchased the domains "savezirbel.com" and
"taintedsupplements.com" and would like us to
formulate some sort of web project with the intent of
achieving one or all of the following; educating the public
on Tom's case, educating the public on the issue of tainted
supplements, shortening Tom's ban, helping to change
policies as they relate to cases like Tom's, etc. I would
see savezirbel.com being focused on Tom, whereas
taintedsupplements.com would be more clinical in nature.
Some form of Lee's comment above could almost form the
"Read this first." of the website. Any thoughts
on this? Good/bad idea?
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thor
February 1, 2010 (2:10 PM)
Where do I sign up for my subscription!?
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pocohontas
February 1, 2010 (10:29 PM)
Who's Tom???
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